Human opponents

[goaldilmun]

I'd probably just use "Men" in the monster section of the book (page 86) as the basis, which has a hoard class of I (XXI) or XXII depending on type.

it really comes down to what kinds of opponents you want these to be.

Yes indeed!

But, look. I need someone to spell it out, here... Sorry about being an idiot, but the treasure table doesn't really make sense to me. What does the different hoard classes signify? I mean, I to V is pretty straightforward, but from then on... it gets jumbled.

I've never actually played D&D before, you see. Plenty of other RPGs, but never D&D. I am currently playing PF, but I don't like it, which is why I want to try out LL. Point is, I'm a complete rookie at this whole dungeon exploration style of play, and a lot of stuff that seems self evident to others just isn't for me.

So thanks again, in advance.

[greyarea]

It sounds like you have difficulty with the percentages in the higher hoard classes (LL pg 105). Let's look at one to explain, and let's make it XXI for fun since that's one of the classes for the "men" monster:

If you look at the column for CP x1000, you will see that the result is 1d10 (45%). That means that there is a 45% chance that the opponent has 1d10x1000 CP. If you roll a d100 (or 2d10, with one die being 10's and the other 00s) and get 45 or less, then you roll 1d10 to determine how many CP the baddies have (so if you roll a 4 then they have 4000CP).

If you look at the next column for SPx1000, it's similar but 1d4 (25%), which means there's only a 25% chance of 1d4x1000 SP. So the hoard can have a between 1000 and 4000 Silver pieces.

With gems there is no modification to the roll, so there is a 30% chance of 1d8 gems. If you roll a 30 or less to determine if the gems are there, then roll on the gems table on the following page (LL106) to determine the value of the gems. For example, you roll a 25 to determine that there are gems and then a 4 on a 1d8 to determine that there are 4 gems. On the gems table, you roll 1d100 four times, getting a 25, 16, 66, and 37 as your results. This means there are four gems, two worth 25GP, one worth 50GP and one worth a whopping 100GP (GP meaning gold pieces, that is, the value in gold on the open gems market for that gem). Jewelry would work the same way.

Now for magic items, there is a 12% for 1 magic item, but it can only be a sword, armor or misc. weapon. You roll a 1d100 and get a 10, so the baddie has a magic item. Then you roll a d100 and look on the Random Magic Type and ignore (that is, reroll) any result lower than 67. (Alternately, you can roll a d6 and divide by 2 or any other way of choosing between the three item types). Let's say, it's a magic sword. Then you roll a 1d100 and compare the result against the Swords table (LL108) to determine the type of sword. Rolling a 1d100, you get a 65 which is a "Sword +1, +3 vs magical monsters".

----------------

All that said, hoard class VIII through XXII are meant for a being lair. For instance, meeting a nomad tribe with their tents. If you meet an individual nomad, he's likely to have only something from hoard classes I through VII, which are meant for individuals. Since nomads don't have an individual designation in the LL monster section, you can either determine that they carry no personal treasure or use the hoard class of a similar baddie, such as the Berserker which has an individual hoard class of I.


Make sense?

[petespahn]

I'd probably just use "Men" in the monster section of the book (page 86) as the basis, which has a hoard class of I (XXI) or XXII depending on type.

it really comes down to what kinds of opponents you want these to be.

I think he's talking about experience point awards for human and demihuman class opponents. Like if you ran into an NPC party, a high level party would be worth more than a low level one. Unless I misread it.

[Dyson Logos]

Based on the rules in B/X, one way we used to run treasure for NPCs is to roll treasure types VI + VII a number of times equal to the NPCs level.

FURTHER, you also roll 1d20 for each of the following classes of magic items - if you roll the NPC's level or lower on the d20, then she has an item of that type. If she can't use the item rolled, ignore it and she doesn't have it. (For magic items determined using the treasure types VI & VII, they keep even magic items they can't use).

Swords
Armor
Misc. Magic Weapons
Potion
Scroll
Wand/Staff/Rod
Misc Magic Items

[petespahn]

Unless I misread it.

Whoops! And, I guess I did.

+1 what greyarea said.

Also, you, as the DM, are free to include as much or as little treasure as you desire. The hoard class can be used as a guide, but if you want Joe the Huntsman to have 35 gp and a potion of healing, you don't have to worry about rolling for it. Just write down Joe's stats and put 35 gp and a potion of healing in his equipment list.

Welcome to Labyrinth Lord!

[goaldilmun]

Ok, guys. It's a bit hard to explain excactly what I'm looking for here... I need some kind of key or something to interpret the table. Why is a certain monster assigned a certain hoard class? What makes one hoard class more appropriate than another for this or that monster? I realise that the table isn't meant to be absolute law. I'm just trying to get the feel for what amounts and what types of treasure would be good for a human antagonist at a certain level. I know I will get the feel for this after a while playing the game, but it would be nice to have a few pointers from the onset.

(And I do understand how to roll for treasure on the table, what I'm unsure about is assigning HC's to opponents that are not listed in the book)

[goaldilmun]

And yes, I am talking about human and demihuman class opponents. Are you maybe saying that no matter what level these opponents are, I should always look to class I (XXI) or XXII? I am used to thinking higher level (or higher HD) creatures and antagonists give bigger rewards in terms of treasure, an as far as I can see this should be doubly important in LL as most XP comes from treasure.

[goaldilmun]

Or, let's try an example: What if there's a High priest of Seth (Cleric 8), sorrounded by his 2 underling priests (cleric 4) and 4 acolytes (cleric 1)? How much treasure would you guys generally assume these guys would have? Or is this a kind of antagonist you wouldn't use? Maybe high level humans aren't normal as opponents at all in classic games?

[gentleman john]

The only time that i have ever used the hoard classes is when I've been rolling for random encounters, and then I've never questioned the reason behind the tables. For programmed encounters I've always assigned what seemed reasonable at the time or for the adventure.

To use your example of the High Priest of Seth and his retinue, I would assign the High Priest some jewelry to reflect his status (say in the 1000s of GP) and 4 magic items or relics (1 for every 2 levels). He would not necessarily be carrying these himself, but might have them in a strongbox that is being carried by his acolytes or some level 0 hirelings (no point in statting these up as they would just drop everything and run at the first sign of trouble).

His priests would get some minor bits and pieces of ceremonial gear (in the 100s of GPs) and 2 magic items each (again, 1 per 2 levels). The acolytes would get some 10s of GP in random clerical supplies and no magic items. After all, they're only level 1.

Mind you, they could all be members of an order that had taken a vow of poverty; in which case, they would have some alms (SP and CP, mainly, given the economy of my games). However, I would keep the magic items. High level priests are more likely to have relics with them.

"You've got a finger of Our Lord? I thought they only came in packs of 10!" - Baldrick (Blackadder I)

[goaldilmun]

Ok. Thanks to everyone who replied! Really appreciate all the effort everyone has put into helping me out.

Guess the bottom line is that I should just go with my gut on this, like everyone has suggested from the start . Though I'm still curious about the logic behind the table. Just being stubborn, I guess.

Keep pushin