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Hi all, I've been thinking about the request for a book that compiles the LL core book with the AEC. I'm posting a poll to see whether more people would want this as one volume or whether it should be two volumes with monsters, treasure, rules for creating dungeons etc. in a second volume. I can see the advantages and disadvantages of both.

I am unconvinced of its necessity, but if it were to be done, it would be nice to have a PHB/DMG kind of split. On the other hand, all in one is nice for compactness...

Put me down as No preference.

I voted "one volume". If you are going to be playing "Advanced Labyrinth Lord", it would be nice to have all of the magic items lumped together...along with all of the monsters. As for the PH/DMG type setup...what is this 1979? This "separation of duties" books may have been a good idea at one point (especially since the game was pretty new to the world and knowledge of it was uncommon)...but now it would just seem like a Late TSR/WotC cash grab. The years long arguments of "I don't want my players looking up monsters during the game" is crap. I thought it was funny that the old Dungeon Masters guide had the attack tables and saving throws like they were some well guarded secret...but the character sheet would usually have that information on it anyway so I don't know why it wasn't in the Players Handbook.

The thing I like about the "one book" (and OSRIC is an example of this) is that if you purchase this "one book"...then you have a complete game to either play in or run as a game master. If you bought it just to get into playing...you can always go into being a game master as you have all the stuff you need in that "one book". I would guess this is the appeal to some of the "box sets" out there...again...a complete game in one package.

As for players reading all about the magic items and monsters during off-time...so what? Back in the 80's it was never an issue because as soon as or forbade anyone from looking at those books...they just bought their own and read it anyway (or read it in someone else's book). With PDFs of the game floating around...it is even easier today. And the paranoia of players looking up magic items or monsters during play seems a bit silly. How big are these groups that you can't see a player with a book open up to the page with the dragons on it? Besides...its 2012! With PDFs lying around...just print out the page of spells that the one mage or cleric in the group needs during play. For games like Labyrinth Lord...no one needs the books during play as their character sheets have all the info they need (except for the spells mentioned prior)

My first impression was for one volume but that would be for my ease as a GM. Having it split into two volumes would be okay but how about one PHB and one with everything a GM needs, including the PHB? That would actually be ideal. That way players could get manuals for less money than a complete book, or more accurately I could purchase enough players books to go around the table and have one Complete book for my use. With the standard PHB/DMG split, nobody would just buy a DMG book, they would have to have the PHB. But with a complete and PHB if a player decides at some point they are going to start GMing then having the extra PHB around is always a good thing. So why not make a complete and players?

I would also suggest to add a "Labyrinth Arcana" section with optional rules such as a few extra subclasses and subraces that allowed for a few more choices.

Eldrad wrote:I would also suggest to add a "Labyrinth Arcana" section with optional rules such as a few extra subclasses and subraces that allowed for a few more choices.

I voted for one volume and I like this idea as well.

Black Wyvern wrote:My first impression was for one volume but that would be for my ease as a GM. Having it split into two volumes would be okay but how about one PHB and one with everything a GM needs, including the PHB? That would actually be ideal. That way players could get manuals for less money than a complete book, or more accurately I could purchase enough players books to go around the table and have one Complete book for my use. With the standard PHB/DMG split, nobody would just buy a DMG book, they would have to have the PHB. But with a complete and PHB if a player decides at some point they are going to start GMing then having the extra PHB around is always a good thing. So why not make a complete and players?

While that seems like a good idea, I think it doesn't really apply with a simple game like LL. From my experience, the only time the players need-- or should-- look at the rule book is during character creation. The rest of the rules are so simple as to be non-existent, and this isn't 3.5 where players are required to be well-versed in the colossal miasma that is the combat rules.

Don't get me wrong; I still think a little softcover "player's handbook" like the Mentzer basic set had would be cool. I just don't think it's essential.

Yes, but make it advanced with just the advanced options. Leave the race-as-classes behind.

Put the gold pieces per class with equip or in the class listing. Put the spell list in front of the spells. Etc.

I was thinking of looking up spell descriptions which still happens a lot, leveling, because a chunk of players are all doing that at the same time and it doesn't always take place at the end of a session, and I just notice a lot when a save or important to hit happens, players like to double check their characters sheets. I have the same issue with B/X which is simpler character wise than LL-AEC. Players like to look stuff up, always have always will. I think you underestimate the size of a book that contains all the pertinent player information. With spells and combat rules it would be a pretty large tome. You are looking at roughly 61 pages from the LL and 85 from the AEC. So it would be about the same page count as the core book.

Kiltedyaksman - I personally agree I think those that supplement a core LL game with some AEC options probably like having the AEC as a separate book they can cherry pick from. I use the AEC for my AD&D styled games so I use the full spell lists, disallow race as class, use advanced HD, etc. Having a just AD&D styled tome would be nice. Though I am sure that would take even more editing.